• adonis@kbin.social
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    1 year ago

    New user: I have a problem 😊

    Everyone:👍

    • are you on xorg or wayland?
    • pulseaudio or pipewire?
    • what WM/DE are you using?
    • amd or nvidia?
    • what distro?
    • systemd?

    New user: Nevermind 😮‍💨

    • echo@sopuli.xyz
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      1 year ago

      if a new user is using a distro that doesn’t use systemd they fell for a meme

      • corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
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        1 year ago

        if a new user is using a distro that doesn’t use systemd they fell for a meme

        Or they hate fridge art like systemd and are on something like PCLinuxOS or Alpine.

        • echo@sopuli.xyz
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          1 year ago

          That’s what I mean though, why would a new user be running alpine as a desktop os?

    • Nuuskis9@feddit.nl
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      1 year ago

      At this point, my biggest dream is that these ‘new user’ distros used only Wayland, Pipewire, Systemd and Flatpaks simply to simplify things. Hopefully we’re less than 2024 away from NoVideo Wayland support.

      Also as soon as XFCE releases their Wayland support, that soon it’ll become the most famous DE choice of Mint.

      What I am really happy is to see how well supported Pipewire already is. Pipewire has never showed any problem in the new installs for me.

      • fubo@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        So … basically Pop!_OS.

        That’s what I’m using now, and it’s what I’d recommend for most desktop users. I’ve been using Linux systems on-and-off since before kernel version 1.0: Slackware, then Debian, then Ubuntu, then Mint, then Pop.

        (Admittedly, my use cases are pretty simple: a terminal, a browser, Signal, VLC, and Steam.)

        • Jarmer@slrpnk.net
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          1 year ago

          Pretty much. Pop is my go-to recommendation for pretty much anyone these days. It’s so well polished and just easy.

            • Nayviler@lemmy.ca
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              1 year ago

              Yes, that pop os. As luck would have it, Linus installed it during a very brief period where the steam package in their repo was broken. This is not a common occurrence, and I have never heard of it happening before or since.

            • unknown@sh.itjust.works
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              1 year ago

              This whole series triggered me so hard. They went out of their way to test it under the worst possible conditions.

              • last at night
              • setting a goal with a deadline/time constraints for first run
              • not stopping and reading or thinking, just assuming away
              • copy paste from google frsit thing that looks vagualy right
              • tunnel vission
              • not resources like Emily, ensuring they make big mistakes

              Then they follow up with hypocrisy of this shit, after going on and on about UI not being right or hard to use for the end user.

      • KindaABigDyl@programming.dev
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        1 year ago

        The problem with that is most major distros market themselves as “new user” distros to some extent though. Noob-friendly, out-of-the-box, easy, etc are all distro-marketing buzz-words that mean nothing.

        You can’t expect them to only use Wayland, Pipewire, Systemd, and Flatpaks because that dream requires every distro to use Wayland, Pipewire, Systemd, and Flatpaks, which will never be reality.

        Most distros will probably eventually adopt these tools, but there won’t be a sudden shift. It will be gradual.

        • Nuuskis9@feddit.nl
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          1 year ago

          Well, for Pipewire it’s the apps which needs to adjust at this point. Only thing missing currently is the Wayland but it’s coming. Making Linux less fragmented (read: confusing), the more new users will give a try.

      • michaelrose@lemmy.ml
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        1 year ago

        pipewire seems ready for primetime but I’m more dubious about Wayland. For instance KDE appears to still be a bit flaky and sway still works poorly under Nvidia and will never have proper mixed DPI for xwayland apps. Still seems like a tradeoff vs X which doesn’t require a compromise. XFCE is roughly 10% of Mint users. Mint users are unlikely to switch because of wayland support

      • corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
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        1 year ago

        Systemd

        Fridge art. Fuck, they MAYBE have nfsroot working. MAYBE. After a decade of fucking around, when it was available for ages. The number of bags on the side of lennart’s piece of crap, just to reinvent the wheels we had before, is absolutely ridiculous.

        and Flatpaks

        … break single source of truth for as-built information and current software manifest. This kills validation, which dissolves certainty on consistency, then repeatability. And given the state of the software load exported to management tools is NOT the flatpak source of truth, you now have a false negative on the ‘installation’ of a flatpak resource when checking it via management.

        Oh. That needs to be on the interview questions.

        • EuroNutellaMan@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Gonna be honest with you I’m an intermediate user and understood jack shit of what you just said. A beginner and average user would have probably been scared off by Linux by this point rewding this.

          • Rooty@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            If I understood the funny words magic man correctly, he is complaining that flatpaks don’t come from a single trusted source and may become a vector for malware, unlike official distro repositories. Still, that was a very technobabble way of saying it.

    • michaelrose@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      Doing tech support, I encountered this attitude. People like that are nearly impossible to help. “Why can’t you just fix it!” The true answer never given is that your problem is probably something stupid you are doing, like trying to make a phone call by physically shoving the phone entirely up your asshole, and until I run through some common problems and ask some questions, I won’t be able to tell you to have your significant other get the salad tongs and pull it out of your rear and then go over “dialing.”

      People mostly need to be willing to gather detailed system info with Inxi and share it.

      • bouh@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        No. That’s the support job to figure out the problem of the user. It is not the user’s job to figure out the support problems.

        I work in support, so I know what I’m talking about. Unfortunately most computer guys are elitist assholes who can’t understand a user doesn’t have their knowledge or even the will to understand why this shitty tech is not working.

        • michaelrose@lemmy.ml
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          1 year ago

          Free open source software projects you don’t pay for don’t have paid support. If you talk to a fellow user it IS your job to figure out your problem. if you don’t have the will to understand anything you ought to buy a support contract.

          • Zoidsberg@lemmy.ca
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            1 year ago

            I don’t disagree with you, but to answer OP’s question, I think this right here is the problem. I love Linux for the same reason I love building my own PCs and working on my own car. For most people that don’t want to tinker, though, they’re looking for something that “just works” and can be fixed by someone else when it breaks.

            • ѕєχυαℓ ρσℓутσρє@lemmy.sdf.org
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              1 year ago

              It’s such a privileged attitude, though. One CAN get paid support, but they don’t need it if they’re just a bit patient and willing to follow instructions. If you don’t want to pay, don’t expect someone else to deal with your bullshit.

              (I’m not saying this to you, but to anyone who has this attitude.)

              • michaelrose@lemmy.ml
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                1 year ago

                It case the subject wasn’t entirely clear in my prior post I agree with you, and that is exactly what I was trying to say. You the user of a foss project, aren’t a customer unless you give someone money. It IS your job to figure out your own issues. If you ask for help from your fellow users and they graciously provide you help then this is a gift you should appreciate. Because the person isn’t an expert on that topic in the employ of the creator, they might not know everything, nor do they have the infinite patience imparted by being paid by the hour to provide you help. They have their own shit to do. Treating them with entitlement and contempt like people treat support will burn these sorts of folks out, and they are far from an infinite resource. If you want a paid support relationship instead of treating the open source community as free help whose time you are entitled to, you ought to actually pay someone to do that job.

    • Nalivai@discuss.tchncs.de
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      1 year ago

      Why don’t you magically have a magic button that magically fixes everything with no effort of my own? That’s stupid, I think I will go on social media and repeatedly tell everyone that Linux is bad actually

    • ѕєχυαℓ ρσℓутσρє@lemmy.sdf.org
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      1 year ago

      So you want them to provide answers by using magic? If you seek support for any software, open source or otherwise, you’ll need to tell them version, build number etc. Why do you think Linux will be any different?

      • Dhs92@programming.dev
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        1 year ago

        Because people can already barely provide this level of information for a Windows device. Most of these words look like technobabble to non-tech-enthusiasts

        • ѕєχυαℓ ρσℓутσρє@lemmy.sdf.org
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          1 year ago

          Of course the words will be different. They aren’t hard words. And they can be answered very easily. In fact, most forums ask to include an output of something like inxi -Fazy with every question, thus eliminating the need for all of these things.

          For more niche problems, people might ask for more specific information. But most of the time, they’ll tell you exactly what to run to get that information.

          You know what’s the Windows alternative for this? Most of the time, nothing. You need to reinstall Windows. Mac is similar, except you need to have it replaced. You actually CAN repair Linux. That’s the difference.