Edited title to match articles title.

  • Chariotwheel@kbin.social
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    23
    arrow-down
    6
    ·
    1 year ago

    Well, killing some and hope the rest will try to flee to Egypt at which point Gaza is free for the taking.

    Or well, maybe, they hope that in desperation people will try to rush the blockade, at which point they just kill them. Hamas awful actions have given Israel plenty of ammunition to keep everyone else on the world stage away for a while, no matter what they do now.

    • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      33
      arrow-down
      19
      ·
      1 year ago

      Hamas awful actions

      Didn’t happen in a vacuum…

      There’s reasons people are willing to die in a war they have no chance of winning.

      It’s stand up for your people or watch them essentially be tortured slowly to death.

      • Chariotwheel@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        30
        arrow-down
        9
        ·
        1 year ago

        I mean, at the same time I can’t support mass rape. Or rape in general.

        Also not a fan of carrying around naked corpses of multilated people. Not a fan.

        • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          26
          arrow-down
          18
          ·
          1 year ago

          You think every Palestinian is doing that?

          That’s the main use of propaganda, take some isolated incidents that really did happen nd really are inexcusable, and amplify the shit out of that so people think the whole side is doing that.

          The militaries of both sides are doing awful shit, but only one side has the power to enforce peace.

          • Chariotwheel@kbin.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            20
            arrow-down
            5
            ·
            1 year ago

            You think every Palestinian is doing that?

            Which part of “Hamas awful actions” made you think that I extend this to all Palestinians?

            • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              10
              arrow-down
              19
              ·
              1 year ago

              I mean, at the same time I can’t support mass rape. Or rape in general

              If the actions of a few are enough for you not to support Palestinians…

              Then yeah, you’re extending that to all Palestinians.

              • Chariotwheel@kbin.social
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                21
                arrow-down
                4
                ·
                edit-2
                1 year ago

                Why do I need to support mass rape to support the Palestinian peoples right to a state and a free life?

                At what point is mass rape necessary for that?

                Rape is wrong and I stand by that in what appears to be a surprisingly controversial move.

                • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  6
                  arrow-down
                  14
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  You don’t…

                  No one said you had to, even suggested you should…

                  But when you take the actions of a few and blame an entire population for the actions of those few…

                  That’s bigotry. That’s no different than seeing a gay child abuser and claiming all gay people abuse children, or seeing a Black drug dealer and saying all Black people are now drug dealers.

                  Hell, I’m American and was in the military. American military members rape other American military members at a truly disturbing rate. Does that mean I’m guilty because I belong to the same population? To take it even further, do you blame those victims as well?

                  Do you legitimately not understand? Because I’m starting to have doubts on your sincerity

                  • Chariotwheel@kbin.social
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    13
                    arrow-down
                    2
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    I don’t know why you keep insisting that I disavow all Palestinians.

                    That deep into the thread I don’t know if you’re willfully ignorant just to score some points against someone that isn’t me.

                    To spell it out again: I think rape is bad. I think that Palestina should be a state. If that’s somehow incompatible to you, you need to check yourself.

      • DarkGamer@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        15
        arrow-down
        11
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        It’s stand up for your people or watch them essentially be tortured slowly to death.

        There is another option. Negotiate a viable peace, which they have refused to do repeatedly. Palestine is essentially a defeated state that refuses to acknowledge its loss or make concessions. The only victory condition they are willing to entertain is not viable and their insistence on fighting an unwinnable war, often via guerilla attacks and terrorism, will not end well for them.

        [Hamas’s charter,] article 13, “There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors.”
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas_Charter

        • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          10
          arrow-down
          5
          ·
          1 year ago

          Gaza’s last election was 17 years ago…

          And Israel both refuses to recognize Hamas as a government, but also refuses to help Gaza hold an election.

          They won’t negotiate with Gaza, which because it was separated from the West Bank by Israel is essentially it’s own government. It’s pretty classic “divide and conquer”.

          And before you say “Israel shouldn’t be involved” then why are they in charge of pretty much every other facet of Gaza?

          • DarkGamer@kbin.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            7
            arrow-down
            6
            ·
            1 year ago

            Wikipedia says Palestinian presidential elections were indefinitely postponed by Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas due to a Hamas-Fatah schism:

            The elections took place amid a tense atmosphere between Fatah and Hamas over the postponement of more major elections that were also scheduled for 2021. It was also reported that voters were angry with the postponement of the presidential election and the legislative election by President Mahmoud Abbas.
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021%E2%80%9322_Palestinian_local_elections


            Israel both refuses to recognize Hamas as a government, but also refuses to help Gaza hold an election. … And before you say “Israel shouldn’t be involved” then why are they in charge of pretty much every other facet of Gaza?

            Because they are an adjacent hostile terrorist state, dedicated to their destruction, that they want to contain via leverage?

      • eatthecake@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        arrow-down
        9
        ·
        1 year ago

        Raping women is standing up for palestinians is it? How exactly have the actions of hamas helped the palestinian people?

        • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          7
          arrow-down
          5
          ·
          1 year ago

          You can just scroll down and read the rest of the comment chain.

          I’ll even quote the first for free

          You think every Palestinian is doing that?

          That’s the main use of propaganda, take some isolated incidents that really did happen nd really are inexcusable, and amplify the shit out of that so people think the whole side is doing that.

          The militaries of both sides are doing awful shit, but only one side has the power to enforce peace.

          • eatthecake@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            6
            arrow-down
            9
            ·
            1 year ago

            You said hamas awful actions didnt happen in a vacuum and that they are standing up for their people. You are justifying mass rape as a war tactic. There is plenty criticize israel for but justifying the torture of civillians is appalling.