I love that. “GOD created them that way to FOOL the unbelievers! He also created the universe to appear older than it is, but we knows better!” The laws of time, space, reason, and logic bend to fit their narrative.
I kind of subscribed to that line of thought before my deconversion. That if we believe in a god with unlimited power, he has the power to create a universe that’s already 13 billion years old. But if God did that, then he’d be presenting a 6,000 year old universe as a 13 billion year old one. And doing so would make him a liar. But God doesn’t tell lies? And a god capable of lying is not a god worth following. But a god that is incapable of lying is limited in his abilities. And a god limited in his capabilities is not worth following.
It always annoys me how hard it is for me to make people understand this. I often debate the concept of spirituality and Gods in general, and people (in the US) always reply with some response like ‘but catholic church bad.’ Which, sure, I’m not disagreeing, but is such a narrow viewpoint and doesn’t exactly have anything to do with the possibility of a God or Gods existing.
Nah it wouldn’t make him a liar- it isn’t necessarily an attempt to fool humans, in my opinion any God capable of doing something like that did it for their own reasons, not as some cosmic prank
If God was real he would probably be a massive pervert, considering he’s just watching us while we don’t have clothes on all the time. Bit of a weirdo.
Man, I sure do love it when our all-loving God does everything in his power to trick non-believers into further doubt so they burn in hell for eternity!
I mean the “fool unbelievers” thing is stupid but also it’s not really unreasonable that if you could speak things into existence and did so for cosmic entertainment or whatever that you would make it at the point that it’s actually interesting. Like if I was going to make people I probably wouldn’t start with infants, I would start with actual independent ones. Likewise I wouldn’t start with an infant universe
But then how do you know he did not create everything 5 seconds ago? Shouldn’t be a problem for him to create memories surely. Or maybe he hasn’t created anything yet, but he is just thinking about it and we are literally his imagination.
The logical conclusion of this is we can’t really know anything including wether or not god is real, which brings us right back to the start, doesn’t it?
No, you are completely right, but it’s kind of the same with the “we are living in a simulation” thing (there isn’t really a functional difference between a God’s imagination and a simulation).
A more interesting question to me is not where we came from, but if there is an endgame. Created 5 seconds, 500 million years ago, ‘real’, or just avatars in a superconsciousness, the question remains- is there a “RIGHT” way to use our agency and experience?
Nah god is definitely just an introvert who doesn’t want us to know about him. Joke’s on the thiests, they’re gonna be eternally punished for not leaving him alone. Which is horrible–did I mention he’s also an asshole? /s (/s because I don’t believe in any god, to be clear)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omphalos_hypothesis
I love that. “GOD created them that way to FOOL the unbelievers! He also created the universe to appear older than it is, but we knows better!” The laws of time, space, reason, and logic bend to fit their narrative.
If that’s the case god might as well have created everything last Thursday
It was last Tuesday you sauceless heretic!
Last Thursdayists are a schism of Last Tuesdayism, and believe the universe is remade every Thursday.
Removed by mod
I kind of subscribed to that line of thought before my deconversion. That if we believe in a god with unlimited power, he has the power to create a universe that’s already 13 billion years old. But if God did that, then he’d be presenting a 6,000 year old universe as a 13 billion year old one. And doing so would make him a liar. But God doesn’t tell lies? And a god capable of lying is not a god worth following. But a god that is incapable of lying is limited in his abilities. And a god limited in his capabilities is not worth following.
Why is a god simply being capable of lying not worth following? If he’s capable and chooses not to, isn’t that a better god than one who can’t lie?
Well this god installed thirteen billion years of red-shifted light from the furthest visible stars. Last Tuesday.
If God is to be regarded as an authority figure, punishes you for telling lies, and can himself lie, God is to be trusted no more than the police.
In fact, we should be challenging God like we do with the police.
Which kind of explains a lot about this country.
Being able to lie doesn’t make you a liar or untrustworthy. Lying does.
Yeah but he did though. Multiple times.
I’m not talking about a specific god, just the general concepts of gods.
It always annoys me how hard it is for me to make people understand this. I often debate the concept of spirituality and Gods in general, and people (in the US) always reply with some response like ‘but catholic church bad.’ Which, sure, I’m not disagreeing, but is such a narrow viewpoint and doesn’t exactly have anything to do with the possibility of a God or Gods existing.
Nah it wouldn’t make him a liar- it isn’t necessarily an attempt to fool humans, in my opinion any God capable of doing something like that did it for their own reasons, not as some cosmic prank
If God was real he would probably be a massive pervert, considering he’s just watching us while we don’t have clothes on all the time. Bit of a weirdo.
I mean according to some religions he was the one who told people to put some clothes on in the first place
Man, I sure do love it when our all-loving God does everything in his power to trick non-believers into further doubt so they burn in hell for eternity!
What a swell guy
And God did all this last Tuesday.
I mean the “fool unbelievers” thing is stupid but also it’s not really unreasonable that if you could speak things into existence and did so for cosmic entertainment or whatever that you would make it at the point that it’s actually interesting. Like if I was going to make people I probably wouldn’t start with infants, I would start with actual independent ones. Likewise I wouldn’t start with an infant universe
But then how do you know he did not create everything 5 seconds ago? Shouldn’t be a problem for him to create memories surely. Or maybe he hasn’t created anything yet, but he is just thinking about it and we are literally his imagination.
The logical conclusion of this is we can’t really know anything including wether or not god is real, which brings us right back to the start, doesn’t it?
No, you are completely right, but it’s kind of the same with the “we are living in a simulation” thing (there isn’t really a functional difference between a God’s imagination and a simulation).
A more interesting question to me is not where we came from, but if there is an endgame. Created 5 seconds, 500 million years ago, ‘real’, or just avatars in a superconsciousness, the question remains- is there a “RIGHT” way to use our agency and experience?
Nah god is definitely just an introvert who doesn’t want us to know about him. Joke’s on the thiests, they’re gonna be eternally punished for not leaving him alone. Which is horrible–did I mention he’s also an asshole? /s (/s because I don’t believe in any god, to be clear)
And he made the earth flat but he is fooling the non-believers into thinking it’s a globe! Trust me bro
This feels like the Haruhi Suzumiya theory where the universe was created like 2 years prior to the beginning of the series.
And somehow the one created for a young adult novel series seems more realistic than the one actual people believe.
The thing is, many of these issues shows up in Christianity, and not in Judaism or Islam.